Cool video ninty. Lol, offtopic I guess but I remember a Tom Green special in Japan where one of those gets in his van.

at least one person understood what I was trying to get across.

[quote:072e9]As u can see, the only reason people are against it are because they personally think its disgusting, which, is not a suitable reason for restricting ones rights, or because of religious reasons, but as it clearly states in the very first ammendment, since there is no law on religion, there should not be a law restricting something for a religous reason.[/quote:072e9]

[quote:4ce24]there should not be a law restricting something for a religous reason.[/quote:4ce24]

What is being proposed here is ironic since it essentially says "we are willing to limit free speech and free thought since the ideas created based on religion run contrary to what we envision the spirit of Civil Liberties/Rights to be" -

I know you Lefties were facists. . .always fun to be proven right.

[/quote:e73f5]

I understand, and am In total agreeance. As soon as religion mixes with government you have troubles ahead. Especially in western countries which tend to be melting pots for different cultures and religions.

We have an issue down here similar to this. Regarding a civil union bill being passed in our country allowing intersex marriage. Only real outcry against it is from misguided christians being led by this crazy minister guy Brian Tamaki who has turned his series of churches into a cult.....They do huge marches, it's kinda freaky.

Pics might be a little big, but I think they're relevant in terms of pointing out the seriousness of this issue, religion in government etc, and how crazed people can become once they find a leader they truly believe in.

[url:e73f5]http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/images/0408/3f723c9ff59b976e07c4.jpeg[/url:e73f5]
....This is from a march against the civil union bill
Guys in the black shirts are the "destiny church" members.....They're basically Brian Tamaki's henchmen.

[img]http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/images/0408/9e1bfdb206dc51447670.jpeg[/img]

More henchmen. People started calling them the "black shirts." rofl.

[img]http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/images/0408/c8f04e851a1124f9d77d.jpeg[/img]
....The head honcho himself.

I saw this "Enough Is Enough" parade all over the tv, and it was really frightening and eerie. It was too much like a nazi rally. What scares me even more is that this guy is going into parliment (Government). A perfect example of why religion doesn't work in government.

So you are saying (Trunks, Mad) that being gay is some kind of religion.

lol, this is like the third time in a row you guys have totally missed the point.

No offense, but isn't it clear?

What they're saying is that religious groups such as christians deny homosexuality because it's written in the bible that it is wrong, etc, and to base laws on that is to base laws on christianity. Which is unfair to those that are of any other religion, or of no religion, like many gay people are.

gay marriage is for fags!!1

thankyou.

[quote:fba1c]Which is unfair to those that are of any other religion, or of no religion, like many gay people are.[/quote:fba1c]

So better to deny folks their right to free speech than for them to deny you your right to have the state recognize your desire to sodomize. . .

Fabbo system. . .

[quote:fba1c]thankyou.[/quote:fba1c]

You're supporting a flawed argument. . .

[quote:4a043]So better to deny folks their right to free speech than for them to deny you your right to have the state recognize your desire to sodomize. . .[/quote:4a043] How are we denying people their freedom of speech? The only thing that I see being denied is a gay's right to marry... I do not quite understand who exactly is getting their freedom of speach denied to them. Plz explain.

TGB...how do you take gays getting married and turn it into Christian censorship? I must be sub-human or somthing becuase I'm not making that connection. I don't see gays getting married as a muzzle for the Christian Right in fact I think it will make them speak up even more.

I understand what they are saying. That somehow the gays right to practice or not practice religion has been trampled on by the passage of this law. SORRY Two gay guys can still go to a lawyer and draw up power of attorneys, provide economic support for one another, name each other beneficiary of any insurance policies, hell one of them can even take the others last name. And if the relationship sours later, all it takes is a call to the lawyer to break it up. All the advantages to a marriage can already be provided within the laws of the State of Kansas right now. The laws and regulations governing marriage, in the State of Kansas, are long and boring to read, but always included "the union between a man and a woman".

johnj,
1) Definitions change with time.
2) Ur still missing the fact that marriage is a right that cannot be denied.
3) So, from wat uve said, there is absolutely no reason for anybody to get married...

1. That definition hasn't changed yet.

2. Marriage is not a right. It is an obligation. Basically it's a contract between a man and a woman where the man agrees to pay to support the woman and the offspring.

3. They don't ask me to any family weddings anymore because I always tell the groom that if he runs long and hard he might escape.

[quote="TGB!":24209][quote:24209]Which is unfair to those that are of any other religion, or of no religion, like many gay people are.[/quote:24209]

So better to deny folks their right to free speech than for them to deny you your right to have the state recognize your desire to sodomize. . .

Fabbo system. . .[/quote:24209]

err....maybe I came into the thread a bit late.

I didn't know christians were being denied free speech....What happened?

My GOD !. I don't see what the fuss is all about when it comes to gay marriage.

This all stems from a homophobic fear. This is 2005. NOT 2347 BC. If it bugs you to see a man join with another man or a women with another women, in all their love ...... then something has to be up. This is not a vendetta the gay population has against you. They only want one thing..... TO be aloud to marry the one they love, like you have the right to marry you spouse of the opposite sex. The only thing that can be seen in any of you against such a harmless idea is that of homophobia. You have a inner dislike for gays and seeing them as having an eqaul right to one such as yourself hurts. Well guess what.......? GET THE FUCK OVER IT, because I tell you this. One day we will look back on this struggle the same way we look back on women's rights and black rights. You can look on your decision and tell your children, or your grandchildren of your actions. annoy:

So how do we figure out who the bitch is?

the_finger:

the one with the gay voice.

no one is being denied free speech, whats going on here?

[quote="Short Hand":4001d]My GOD !. I don't see what the fuss is all about when it comes to gay marriage.

This all stems from a homophobic fear. This is 2005. NOT 2347 BC. If it bugs you to see a man join with another man or a women with another women, in all their love ...... then something has to be up. This is not a vendetta the gay population has against you. They only want one thing..... TO be aloud to marry the one they love, like you have the right to marry you spouse of the opposite sex. The only thing that can be seen in any of you against such a harmless idea is that of homophobia. You have a inner dislike for gays and seeing them as having an eqaul right to one such as yourself hurts. Well guess what.......? GET THE FUCK OVER IT, because I tell you this. One day we will look back on this struggle the same way we look back on women's rights and black rights. You can look on your decision and tell your children, or your grandchildren of your actions. annoy:[/quote:4001d]

Not sure if you have HBO or not but if you've ever seen Bill Maher he had a women on from some women’s organization and she bluntly said "Gays lead t the downfall of the Roman Empire." because of course, greed, corruption, over stretched empire, changing views, and barbarian invaders were just the splinters and gays were the sword that slew the giant.

oOo:

I will agree with you shorthand, people are fucking stupid, they are gay, so what, let them get married it isn't any of your business and it isn't like letting them get married will ruin your marriage...and if it does well your a fuck anyway.

Besides this shit is so tedious and un-important compared to what truly faces Americans.

How are we denying people their freedom of speech? The only thing that I see being denied is a gay's right to marry... I do not quite understand who exactly is getting their freedom of speach denied to them. Plz explain.[/quote:1e1ec]

By YOU attempting to tell anyone - in congress or out - that they CAN NOT form their opinions based on their religious upbringing is indeed attempting to bar the free expression of ideas - whether said person is influencing laws or not.

[quote="Short Hand":b863b]My GOD !. I don't see what the fuss is all about when it comes to gay marriage.

This all stems from a homophobic fear. This is 2005. NOT 2347 BC. If it bugs you to see a man join with another man or a women with another women, in all their love ...... then something has to be up. This is not a vendetta the gay population has against you. They only want one thing..... TO be aloud to marry the one they love, like you have the right to marry you spouse of the opposite sex. The only thing that can be seen in any of you against such a harmless idea is that of homophobia. You have a inner dislike for gays and seeing them as having an eqaul right to one such as yourself hurts. Well guess what.......? GET THE FUCK OVER IT, because I tell you this. One day we will look back on this struggle the same way we look back on women's rights and black rights. You can look on your decision and tell your children, or your grandchildren of your actions. annoy:[/quote:b863b]quit bringing up that homophobic argument. It is very wrong and makes you sounds dumber every time you say it.

I am serious colemon, sooner or later you will regret your current opinion on the issue. Their were people like you when women fought for the right to vote, their were people like you when the south was deeply segregated. This is just another stepping stone, maybe not as large as was in the past, but it stil needs to be accepted and dealt with properly.

This is just a discussion on an internet forum, no one is being denied their freedom of speech. People are being denied their right to marry this very moment.

[quote="TGB!":916fc] How are we denying people their freedom of speech? The only thing that I see being denied is a gay's right to marry... I do not quite understand who exactly is getting their freedom of speach denied to them. Plz explain.[/quote:916fc]

By YOU attempting to tell anyone - in congress or out - that they CAN NOT form their opinions based on their religious upbringing is indeed attempting to bar the free expression of ideas - whether said person is influencing laws or not.[/quote:916fc]

....But wouldn't you agree that under these circumstances, said christians should be looking out for the benefit of the people as opposed to their own personal religious beliefs?
I mean, sure they're allowed their opinions, but these are religious beliefs based on nothing but faith, I'd say they shouldn't be imposing those ideals, as law, on people who aren't faithful to that religion or any religion at all.

Tripper, I'm not basing my position on this issue on my religion. If I were Jewish, and followed the Bible to the letter, I would demand that all of these people be stoned (required punishment in the Old Testament). As a Christian, I have been told, "He who is without sin, cast the first stone." In other words, none of us should judge.

My opinions on this come from my personal belief that the special union between a man and a woman has been under attack for years. As I stated earlier, it is probably only a matter of semantics but I think "marriage" should be reserved and protected as to mean the union between a man and a woman. If two women want to form a life-long union they certainly can, but I don't see it as a marriage. It's really a silly argument on both sides. What difference does it make what you call it, as long as the legal standing in society is the same. But from my side of the aisle I see it as another log on the fire that is trying to burn down the institution of marriage and make it worthless.

Laws are going to be made on the basis of religious beliefs. The fifth commandment is You Shall Not Kill. Laws governing killing people grew out of that commandment. Your argument means laws against murder should be thrown out because you or someone else doesn't believe in the Commandments. Some of you are dividing by zero on this subject.

rock:

Why even try and compare killing to 2 men or women getting married..... It is a pretty basic ideal in human society to have such laws as to not murder people... Laws like these have been around before the bible was ever conceived.

I agree with all of your posts.
I see it as the feminization and acceptance of the pussification of the American male. At my school we have portests for gays and stuff, but arent allowed to wear shirts that deal with supporting our troops-as it may offend some people.

It the leftwing liberals dedicated to letting the minority rule the majority, which is completely against what the founding fathers stood for. I dont think there should be an ammendment to the US constittution, as that would be opposite of my beliefs. I do think that states should have the right to make these ammendments, and if they vote to ban gay marriage than that is ok.

The only problem with this is that it could polarize the country. Even MA is having a revote on their gay marriage ban veto or whatever. Just goes to show that gay rights are not a popular as people want you to think.

Either way, with my backround of farms, trailerparks, and cheap houses in the south, I will never buy the whole "be accepting of gays". I was taught a man is a man, not a little bitch who complains about everything, and brags about being different then everyone else. In America, if you are for gays you are cool and open to things. If you are against gays, you are apparently a Jesus loonatic that is also racist and in the KKK (which is not true). It crazy leftwing liberal talk.

[quote="TGB!":c464c] How are we denying people their freedom of speech? The only thing that I see being denied is a gay's right to marry... I do not quite understand who exactly is getting their freedom of speach denied to them. Plz explain.[/quote:c464c]

By YOU attempting to tell anyone - in congress or out - that they CAN NOT form their opinions based on their religious upbringing is indeed attempting to bar the free expression of ideas - whether said person is influencing laws or not.[/quote:c464c]wrong. I dont care what opinions people have. But when opinions turn into actual laws, then I start to care. Oh and johnj... Me and u both know that murder has nothing to do with it. Murder in itself is morally, the lowest one can go, and i dont need the 10 commandmants to tell me that. Murder is a completely different issue. In this case, people are basing opinions completely on religious beliefs. In the case of murder, 10 commandmants or not, it would still be outlawed. Sure if something said in the bible makes sense, it could be made into law, the main point isnt even that laws are being made based on religion, the point is that in turn, this law limits the rights of gays.

I am sure your grandfather said the sme things to the African American's when they wanted to sit at the front of the bus.... rolleyes:

yup-he worked directly under Wallace in the great state of Alabama. He was on the roof in Tuscaloosa, with the ABI during the 16th street bombings, and was with the ABI at Selma. SOme pretty crazy stuff there.

And Im sure he did, as did MOST of the south. Your personality is based on your surroundings. If you want to be gay thats fine, its when you flaunt it or complain that it becomes a scene (which is all that they want).

Today at school, for example, we had a "silent protest" for gay rights. It was supposed to be representing that the gays arent being heard, and actually got ALOT of people out of presenting an asignment due in class. By Lunch time though, everyone was talking because everyone else in "the cause" was. Just an example of jumping on the bandwaggon to be cool different and stand out.

If you want to be gay, be gay. DOnt flaunt it. Why go to an all balck school because your white, or an all white school because your black? Because you can? To be different? The gays expect to have their festivles in cities throughout America (which is fine) and ask for police protection against protesters. The following week you have a pro-war march. Guess who shows up to protest? The liberals and gays. If any police ask them to leave or wahtever, then they file a lawsuit. Same with Machael Moore. hake:

U dont seem to understand. People dont choose to be gay. They just are, from birth. I guess u could call it a disorder.[/u]

there is no evidence what causes homosexuality.

Do urself a favor. Ask a doctor. Hell, ask a gay. It is an abnormailty, and altho we dont know exactly wat causes it, we do know that nobody actually chooses to gay.

Actually, not all gays are born gay. Some choose to be gay. There are many cases of young people thinking they are gay, due to peer pressure, being "cool" or whatever, who finally find an opposite sex partner, fall in love and get married.


And be careful calling homosexuality an abnormality. That gets the gays really upset. Maybe 'cause if it is an abnormality, it is OK to try and find a cure for it. LOL

Did anyone actually watch the video I posted?

http://www.exn.ca/dailyplanet/view.asp?date=4/11/2005

Scroll down and click on Monkey business.

MY God...... the shame you should feel.

I watched it already, it was awesome beer:

missed the vid the first time, interesting... And Colonel I retracted my previous statement. Most of the time, gays dont have a choice in being gay.