You can't logically support the troops without supporting their cause, ie: The War. That's like saying you support construction workers but don't want the building they are building to be built. Yeah, you may have sympathy for them, but that isn't supporting them.

Going offtopic now...

sorry. beer:

angel:

I'd like to know what you'd do if your wife was raped and you attempted to get her to refuse an abortion. If you honestly believe she would want to have the baby you either know some fucked up women or you just plain have NO idea.

...and it's not all that rare is you probably think it is - Rapists don't use condoms. It's also pretty hard for a woman to work up the nerve to see a pharmacist/doctor and go through the questionaire involved with getting the morning after pill after being raped....

I can't even believe you have think it's a "doozy" when the mother's health is in danger...To me, that is insane. If it were my wife, I'd have no trouble in deciding. The baby has no idea it's dieing. The baby has no idea it's even lived. While obviously I would feel a great loss, and I would be emotionally wrecked, I would be able to move on alot more easily than losing someone I've actually known and loved.

I think outlawing abortion in total is just fucking stupid no matter what side of the fence you sit. I'm for more sternly regulating abortions...But I think just as it is necessary to kill 30,000 civilians in order to save them ( oOo: ), I think it is VERY likely that there would be a chance in which aborting the fetus would be necessary - If you're gonna outlaw abortion under any and all circumstances (which you have made yourself clearly supportive of), you should do the same with your war machine.

That's, for me, where the contradiction lies in the hard-line conservative mindstate....

I said they should get the morning after pill in the case of rape.


Anyway, I don't see the contradiction in the war machine?

That's easy for you to say as a male....

The contradiction is in those who support the war machine AND are hardline against all abortions. Like ALOT of conservatives...

Like you said, the war may have been necessary in the long run. Just like there are obviously cases where abortion is necessary in the long run....and yet if you're totally against abortion and don't agree it would ever be necessary simply because of the loss of life, then how can you ever see war as being necessary - especially when the loss of life is considerably greater?

war can have a greater possibility for loss of life, but remember, I said that I support the war because it would have saved more lives than it lost in the long run. I don't see how that is contradictory, it places value on preserving life as best as possible.

You killed 100 000 Civy's alone in the war. AND now a possible civil war that will ingulf millions. You have done nothing. Get over it. Admit the war was wrong.

People are not statistics you can stack up. rolleyes:

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q= ... arch&meta=

A fetus is an unborn human or animal.
a human embryo in the mother's uterus
A term used to refer to a baby during the period of gestation between eight weeks and term.
The unborn child from around eight weeks after conception (when all major organs are formed and it begins to resemble a human being) to the time of birth.
an unborn baby


Many sites beliveing its an unborn child.

But do any of these arguments really apply to Roe v. Wade? That decision said that there is a right to an abortion in The Constitution. I've read it many times now, and I don't see it. The Tenth Ammendment is clear. Abortion has to be left to the democratic process.

[quote="Short Hand":d4b2c]

People are not statistics you can stack up. rolleyes:[/quote:d4b2c]


like cord wood

[quote="Short Hand":820ca]You killed 100 000 Civy's alone in the war. AND now a possible civil war that will ingulf millions. You have done nothing. Get over it. Admit the war was wrong.

People are not statistics you can stack up. rolleyes:[/quote:820ca]

wow, I had no idea that you liked murderous dictators so much. I will not admit the war was wrong because I don't think it was. I beleive we will have saved more people from being killed deliberately by Hussein than we have killed accidentally while taking him out of power and ending his ability to kill his own people. I can't beleive that someone would say we should have left them alone and let Saddam still kill people. I thought we were against dictators these days?

[quote=c312]wow, I had no idea that you liked murderous dictators so much. I will not admit the war was wrong because I don't think it was. I beleive we will have saved more people from being killed deliberately by Hussein than we have killed accidentally while taking him out of power and ending his ability to kill his own people. I can't beleive that someone would say we should have left them alone and let Saddam still kill people. I thought we were against dictators these days?[/quote:8e1d9]

The country is more fucked probably than it has ever been, despite attempts reconstruction seems to be failing miserably. More people are going to die now, than under Sadaam...What about all the other dictators of the world? If removing Sadaam was the soul intention of the invasion, is the U.S now gonna systematically remove every other dictator in the world from power?

Why go to the middle east, destroy any chance of redeeming western-middle eastern relations by dragging in all the other western nations of the world and make the area a total hotbed of anti-western activity? Remove terrorists? This "police action" just provoked thousands more.

Nice mentality. If they're not supporting the U.S's somewhat radical decisions, then they're supporting murderous dictators - Sure.

Everything is absolutely that black and white, isn't it? Is it not realistic that maybe people think the outcome isn't worth the WAR? War isn't such a great tool for solving problems in the world....It's such a messy business, that it tends to just make alot more problems. Especially when everyone is watching your every move through the huge global media machine.


I realise we're offtopic, but I just don't get it....

[quote="TGB!":4a9c6][quote:4a9c6]
The contradiction is in those who support the war machine AND are hardline against all abortions. Like ALOT of conservatives...[/quote:4a9c6]

The great MAJORITY of Americans, liberal and conserve - believe in abortion as a medically neccesary procedure - so I dont know where this "ALOT" comes from or this obsession that that opinion is a dominant one among those with the same belief.[/quote:4a9c6]

You're right - I did exaggerate that, I guess I was really only talking to c312 about this and It got more and more deeper as I was amazed he didn't agree it was sometimes a necessary procedure. All this talk of "banning" abortion made me jump the gun...I still think HE is nuts for denying that it is often a necessary procedure.

Didn't I say I would support it in the case of the mother's health?

[img]http://jesusburger.net/upload/1078657688junior2.jpg[/img]

think opinions would change if the above would happen to every member here