Nvida "over optimizing"?
 

[quote:63486]Germans claim Nvidia caught over optimising - [Computer Hardware]
Submitted by Forcefire on 8/30/2005 8:53:05 AM 22 Comments


WE CALL IT optimisation these days, but what do you call it when a firm over optimises? We used to call it something different in the days of the NV30, when Nvidia had to do something to make its chip work better and do better in benchmarks but to our surprise it seems to have done it again. The chaps from 3D Center, a very talented in-depth site, spotted and tested and proved that Nvidia is using a lower anisotropic filtering quality than any other card available.

Those guys noticed a texture shimmering problem when you are using normal driver settings. This was the case with NV40 cards but you could resolve this flickering by using high quality driver settings. This won't work on G70 based cards, so the guys well known for its thorough benchmarks went digging a little deeper into the chip.

It turns out that Nvidia is not doing anisotropic filtering the way it should and that the picture quality is the one to suffer. You will get the shimmering effect on your textures whenever you are using Geforce 7800GTX cards but you won't see this using Radeon cards.

The guys claimed that all NV40 and G70 cards will suffer from the same flickering problem and that these cards have "by far worse AF quality". They also add that Nvidia got the flickering because it was using general under sampling and as a result is getting the flickers. It's interesting to note that older Geforce 5800 Ultra won't suffer from this, just the new cards that 6800 or 7800 based.

Another German web site Computerbase , went a step further. It made a custom driver by changing the inf, where the driver could not recognise 7800GTX and use its optimisations. The card was listed as unknown but was working just fine. But when the guys went testing they noticed a massive performance drop when using those drivers, close to 30 percent and related it to anisotropic filtering. Nvidia has a lot to explain.

3DCenter, for the original article, is here in English while the Computerbase German article is here. We will ask Nvidia what is going on but we think there's something up. At lease the guys proved it isn’t a hardware bug - it's a driver problem only but performance drops dramatically as soon as you resolve it.

Source: theinquirer [/quote:63486]

Sources are naturally sketchy, anyone have any other info from some place respected. Im off to work now or id look....

Disscuss.

Nvdiowned.

im buying ati.

i remember when this happened before, one of the few reasons ill never go back to nvidia. ati > nvidia

LOL, ATi did it as well with the 8500 (9100 now), on the Q3 engine.. THAT was a huge fiasco as well.

[quote="Short Hand":d7d37]LOL, ATi did it as well with the 8500 (9100 now), on the Q3 engine.. THAT was a huge fiasco as well.[/quote:d7d37]

really? when that came out i wasnt really into computers as much as i am now, so yeah doesnt count biggrin:

lol, you're late they already fixed it... With no performance drop. Just ati fanboy bullshit.
http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=55812

Should I even mention that ATI has the same shimmer problem? (too a lesser degree, but it's still there)
Anyone that says they'll only buy ATI is a tool and a nub. Company loyalty = fucking retarded




PS: Watch the videos that supposed have the shimmer, I bet 98% percent of you won't notice it. Even when playing it against the new drivers with no shimmering, it's nearly impossible to see.

Its obvious that article was written by ATI fanboys. Its completely biased, just the way it is written makes the article a joke.

i will only buy ati ... and ive tried both. i dont think it has anything to do with company loyalty. when you grow use to something, you stick with it.

So if you were to buy high end right now you'd buy a X850XT even though is half as fast as 7800GTX and the same price?

I wonder what geRV would say about this.

Gerv isn't that big of a fanboy.

He has a preference to ATI but at least he knows his shit unlike the other ATI nubboys here.

he dead

I've owned both nvidia and ATi, nvidia was good but over the past years they really shit themselves, so i went ATi and i like them a lot more. I got an X800XL so i dont plan on buying another nvidia card for atleast another 2 years.

They've shit themselves by introducing new technology to push graphics further while actively competing with ATI who hasn't introduced a bit of new technology since the 9700? (Old/mature/proven tech almost always beats new tech, except 6800 vs X800)

The only bad thing Nvidia has done is the FX series. They've fully rebounded back to the top while ATI has done the opposite (severly falling stocks, 7 lawsuits against them, no R520)

The FX series was released when i bought my new video card, and i hear they were bad, plus anything after the Ti300 (which was an awesome card, i loved that one) was pure shit in the Ti series, along with the 5500 and those cards. The only nividia card i like is the 6800.

You're joking right? The GF4 Ti series was great. They were the first cards to be powerful enough to use AA/AF in modern games. Everyone had one. Most people to this day claim the Ti4200 was the best card ever made (in terms of price/performance/features at the time) What did ATI have at the time? 8500... with absolutely horrible drivers. It was worse than a GF3 back then. (It wasn't until the 9700/9800 days that ATI started making good drivers and the 8500 started to catch up to the Ti4200.

Once again, the ONLY bad cards nvidia ever made were the FX series.

Right thats what i was thinking of, i got the 9700 pro when that was realeased because i wanted to try something other than nvidia, becaus i had bad luck with one of the GF4 Ti cards after the 300, it was actually worse than my Ti300. And now i just got the X800XL, so upgrading to another video card isnt going to happen for another 2 years. So for me

/end conversation

yeah i would ... just because ive had better success with ati cards, and for no other reason.

i bought the 6800gt ... i really cant say whether or not it performed better or worse than the x800 (in my mind it didnt perform as well) but i rmad and got the x800 pro. im happier with the x800 pro. i think the 6800 gt was suppose to out perform the x800pro at the time; not really sure tho.

also, hasnt there been tons of reports of both companies doing shadey shit to get the better marks?

Yup, they are both guilty. In fact it has become the norm.

Nvidia > | < Ati Its a stalemate

Indeed...


We need another good competitor in there to stir things up... Something that kick's both Nvidia and ATI's ass with perfect IQ and no optimizations.

i aint no "nubboy" biggrin:

No such thing as a Ti300 babe, Ti200 & Ti500, and the Orginal G2 Ti. (Ultra rare card/first to use DDR ram)

Ti 500 is what i had sorry, i was confusing Geforce 3 with the Ti number. But the Ti 500 was an awesome card.

Jeez, I'm surprised Gerv isn't all over this. biggrin:

I'm confident that in the next generation of consoles the XBox 360 will have the superior GPU, as I always hear rumblings of sketchy goings on over at nvidia.

GERV said the card i got which was nvidia was good...even though he likes ATI

and yes Nvidia rocks all ya'll socks.

[quote="Sicilian_Summers":ee1a0]Jeez, I'm surprised Gerv isn't all over this. biggrin:

I'm confident that in the next generation of consoles the XBox 360 will have the superior GPU, as I always hear rumblings of sketchy goings on over at nvidia.[/quote:ee1a0]
Gerv has been dead for months.

Of course XBox 360 will be superior. It's going to have 48 pixel pipelines, 10MB of embedded RAM, and Unified shader architecture. While the PS3 has a slower 7800GTX in it...

In raw fillrate alone the XBox 360 has no competition. 10.3 GigaPixels/Sec is peak for a 7800GTX while the XBox 360 can push 16GP/s.

The Xbox has an ATi in it doesnt it?

Ya... It's insane too.

What is it though. i mean whats the card called?

I had a ti4400 for 6 years and ran everything great all the way through COD:UO I then upgaded to my 6600 gt and smooth shit again.

Its pretty moot everybody has their preferences. I personally dont like nvidias chipset and will only buy Via.

Its like fords and chevys...everyone has a preference.

R500.
[img]http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/3414/xbox3606yy.jpg[/img]


You're crazy.

Yeah, ive heard nvidia is better than VIA.

just me experience. My nvidia board was complete shit and then died on me within 2 week. My uncle has the dfi lanparty nf3 super 1337 jizz board and fuckin hates it. He cant run bf2, guild wars, joint ops or anything with that and his 6800gt with new drivers because of some gay ass video accelerator graphic driver. he had to go to the 66.93's b4 he could run it.

Should I take this into consideration and NOT buy one? oOo:

For most people the DFI Lanparty nF4 is the greatest motherboard ever made.


I have one and it's amazing.

I have this:

[img]http://img.ferra.ru/pubimages/64393.jpg[/img]

I like it.

I'm glad you do. There is nothing wrong with Via.


But the nforce4 chipset is better and most people don't have problems with it. Shitty luck I guess. I get the same for power supplies... I've had an Antec and 2 Fortrons shit out on me and they are supposed to be 2 of the better companies.

[img]http://www.elrockshop.com/images/products/prcd-7020shih.gif[/img]

beer: