[Stammer]

[url=http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/4208176.stm:ff36c]BBC Article[/url:ff36c]

[quote:ff36c]
Shenzhou VI during lift-off - 12/10/05
Shenzhou VI carried two Chinese astronauts into space
China's launch of its second manned spacecraft, Shenzhou VI, has confirmed the country's place among the space elite.

But as China begins planning a lunar mission in 2007, and with the US and India declaring an interest in another Moon landing - and a manned flight to Mars - are we seeing the dawn of a new space race?

"Once China had announced its first unmanned lunar spacecraft, India came along and said that they were also interested in unmanned lunar exploration," Philip Clark, of the British-based Molniya Space Consultancy, told BBC World Service's Analysis programme.

"They've now signed an agreement with the European Space Agency for joint experiments with the Indian spacecraft.

"And the Japanese have already flown their own unmanned lunar missions," he said.

Forced to go alone

While India's space programme is relatively small, it has made considerable strides in recent years, putting a number of satellites into orbit.

Dr Rodham Narasimhan, the director of India's Space Commission, said the aim of the programme had always been to develop practical civilian applications from the spacecraft.

He described these aims as "developmental - communications, remote sensing, agricultural crop production."

Indian rocket
India has managed to develop its programme through collaboration
But, perhaps because of this, India has also been able - unlike the Chinese - to buy in expertise of other space agencies where necessary.

"We could have India and Japan pooling their resources, because the Japanese have got far more capable launch vehicles than the Indians have," Mr Clark explained.

"But the Chinese are having to basically do everything on their own," he said.

Another reason for this is the view of the Americans towards China.

Although they agreed to join forces with the Russians in the 1990s in developing the International Space Station, the Americans, Mr Clark said, still see China as a rival, not an ally.

"It's not space as such that's the problem... it's what's the Americans see as technology transfer," he said.

"They don't want the Chinese to have access to American technology, because they believe, rightly or wrongly, that any technology that the Chinese get access to will immediately be applied to the Chinese weapons programme."

US mistrust has cost China's space programme much, space analyst Brian Harvey told Analysis.

Ultimately, their attitude has effectively grounded the Chinese commercial launcher programme.

"The Americans specified that no American-built component on any satellite anywhere in the world may fly on a Chinese rocket," Mr Harvey explained.

"This means that although the international space programme is supposed to be international, and all partners are supposed to make decisions together, in fact the reality is that Americans regard it as their own territory and they won't let the Chinese anywhere near it.

"That's a big political argument that is going on," he said.

Partnerships

US President George W Bush has already stated that America's ultimate goal is to return to the Moon by 2020, as a launch pad for missions to Mars and beyond.

But this far-reaching ambition has been in marked contrast to the problems the US space programme has had following the Columbia shuttle disaster in 2003.

Since the end of the Cold War, many analysts have seen an end to solo American missions as inevitable, in favour of closer collaboration with other countries - and therefore shared costs.

Mars rover
Serious plans are now being made for a manned mission to Mars
Any manned mission to Mars would be likely to cost over a $1 trillion, making closer partnerships between space agencies a necessity.

And Nasa's chief scientist for the Moon and Mars, Jim Garvin, said that the first person on Mars would probably be planting a whole sheaf of national flags.

"It's really a playing field for the world community, and the world's always been involved in different ways," he added.

"I see it as a UN-type flag arena on Mars."

Chinese space analyst Wu Ji, at the Centre for Space Science in Beijing, told Analysis that he strongly supported the idea of future space exploration being more collaborative.

"I think in the future we would like to have more international collaboration - not only with Europe, but also with India, with Japan, with the United States. From the Chinese side, we are very open," he said. [/quote:ff36c]

[Johnj]

This is so three days ago.

[Stammer]

Originally Posted by Johnj

This is so three days ago.

loney:

It's pretty intresting in anycase.

[dr nein]

doubtful. nasa in its current state is pretty sad. politicians will get elected and reelected for phrases like "tax cuts" and "social security", not "space program".

[[DAS REICH] Blitz]

Originally Posted by Stammer

loney:

It's pretty intresting in anycase.

because it's a spacerace?

[Miscguy]

[quote="dr nein":02ccf]doubtful. nasa in its current state is pretty sad. politicians will get elected and reelected for phrases like "tax cuts" and "social security", not "space program".[/quote:02ccf]

Sad but true. I wish we would put half the effort into todays space program that we once put into gemini, apollo, and mercury.

[1080jibber]

good for the Chinese, It would be nice to see other countrys do it too, but i dont think alot of countrys dont have that kind of money for funding.

[quote:369cb]US President George W Bush has already stated that America's ultimate goal is to return to the Moon by 2020, as a launch pad for missions to Mars and beyond. [/quote:369cb] Dosnt that seem like a really long time, 15 years to get to the moon again?

[Miscguy]

It is a long time. Frankly there no real reason we shouldnt be able to do it by 2010, or 2015 atleast. Then i think you have to consider, why. What are we going to learn by going back to the moon in preperation for mars? You figure 15 years to go to a place we've already been what 30 some odd years ago? How long to get to mars, 50, 60, 80 years? It really seems a bit more time and effort should be put into this. Theres simply so much to learn from striving for, and acheiving it. Then once its done with, there will still be more evolution of the tech, pushing it even further and truly speeding up technological development in most sectors.

[dr nein]

Originally Posted by 1080jibber

good for the Chinese, It would be nice to see other countrys do it too, but i dont think alot of countrys dont have that kind of money for funding.

[quote:fc1c4]US President George W Bush has already stated that America's ultimate goal is to return to the Moon by 2020, as a launch pad for missions to Mars and beyond.

Dosnt that seem like a really long time, 15 years to get to the moon again?[/quote:fc1c4]

that's probably how long it would take to build another spacecraft capable of reaching the moon with shitty funding. shuttles are in no way suited for the task.

[Eight Ace]

space is for poofs...

[Himmler]

[quote="Eight Ace":62ba5]space is for poofs...[/quote:62ba5]space kicks your ass

[Jimmy Paterson]

nasa pwns all who apose it.

lol. there is no way we would let anyone other then an American be the first person on mars.

[dr nein]

[quote="Jimmy Paterson":fd7b5]nasa pwns all who apose it.

lol. there is no way we would let anyone other then an American be the first person on mars.[/quote:fd7b5]

yeah, like when the ISS and everyone on it would have died if it weren't for the Russians.

[Mr.Buttocks]

[url=http://www.shatters.net/celestia/:f8337]I AM IN SPACE RIGHT NOW GUYS - HI![/url:f8337]

[Trunks]

I think they should do more than just land on the moon, maybe establish some kind of base or something, think about it, wouldnt it be so much easier to go from the moon to mars then from earth to mars?